--Lewis Carroll
As promised, I'll be providing a breakdown of the upcoming changes to the Incursus. Having no better indication of the order to do these in, I'll be tackling all the frigates in alphabetical order. After looking at the changes themselves, there will be possible fittings for the ship provided. As with anything in EVE, the changes are not yet finalized, but hopefully they'll provide a decent enough starting point when the ship hits the Tranquility server and allow people to have a more intelligent discussion about the ship before they're able to fly it themselves.
In case you're not inclined to go check the thread yourself, the new ship statistics without skills are thus:
INCURSUS:
New bonuses: 5% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret damage and 10% bonus to armor repairer effectiveness per level
Slot layout: 3 H, 3 M, 4 L, 3 turrets, no launchers
Fittings: 45 PWG, 135 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 400 / 450 / 500
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 370 / 185 s / 2
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 340 / 3.15 / 1028000 / 3.0 s
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 30km / 600 / 4
Sensor strength: 9 Magnetometric
Signature radius: 42
Of course, if you're anything like me, those stats are pretty meaningless when first looking at them. Let me break it down for you.
New Bonuses: 5% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret damage and 10% bonus to armor repairer effectiveness per level
The Incursus is keeping the 5% Bonus to Damage, but has swapped its 10% Bonus to Falloff for an Armor Repairer Effectiveness bonus turning it into a Frigate-sized Brutix.
Slot Layout: 3 H, 3 M, 4 L, 3 turrets, no launchers
The Ship has gained 2 Low slots. Medium and High Slots as well as Turret/Launcher Hardpoints remain unchanged.
Fittings: 45 PWG, 135 CPU
An increase from 34 PWG and 110 CPU. Keep in mind that these are the base attributes before things like the Engineering or Electronics skill are added. With all fitting skills at Level V it translates into almost 15 more Grid and more than 30 additional CPU.
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 400 / 450 / 500
An increase across the board from 313/368/368. Again, this is before any skills or modules are applied, but the Incursus is shaping up to no longer be the Glass Cannon it once was.
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 370 / 185 s / 2
A substantial increase from 325/234/1.38 after CCP had initially planned to Nerf the Capacitors of all the T1 Frigates. Take a look at the post on page 12 of the thread to see where CCP changed their mind. On a side note, the Cap/Sec number that I'm using here is simply Total Cap/Time to Recharge, which is how CCP presented it. If you're looking in a fitting program, the number is likely much higher as it will be displaying the Cap/Sec at Peak Recharge instead of over the entire recharge period.
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 340 / 3.15 / 1028000 / 3.0 s
Any change is negligible from 344/3.1445/1028000/3.02. A slight decrease in speed (keep in mind the Incursus's speed was recently buffed) and the Agility and Align numbers might just have been CCP Ytterbium rounding them in the post.
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5
No change.
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 30km / 600 / 4
Originally 37500/620/3, so a slight nerf to Targeting Range and Locking Speed, but one additional Target.
Sensor strength: 9 Magnetometric
No Change.
Signature radius: 42
A slight decrease from 44. Theoretically, this could mean as much as a 5% decrease in damage taken both from the Tracking and Missile Damage Formulas, but after skills are taken into account it will likely be closer to 1% and I doubt even noticeable for the majority of situations.
Fittings
Of course, all of the above doesn't really mean anything once modules and skills affecting the hull are taken into account. The fits that follow are my own creation and I make no claims they are the absolute best they can be. I restricted the fittings to Meta 5 and below, some other things are of course possible with Deadspace and Faction modules, but I feel this provides a good baseline. Hopefully they can give some impression of what the ships will be capable of after the changes. I provide them here without further commentary of my own, feel free to tear them apart in the comments.
[New Incurses, Dual Rep]
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Small Armor Repairer II
Small Armor Repairer II
1MN Afterburner II
Initiated Harmonic Warp Scrambler I
Small Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400
Light Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Small Nanobot Accelerator I
Small Nanobot Accelerator I
Small Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Hobgoblin II x1
Effective HP: 3,160 (Eve: 2,744)
Tank Ability: 147.96 DPS
Shield Resists - EM: 12.50%, Ex: 56.25%, Ki: 47.50%, Th: 30.00%
Armor Resists - EM: 57.50%, Ex: 23.50%, Ki: 44.75%, Th: 44.75%
Capacitor (Stable at 32.42%)
Volley Damage: 476.16
DPS: 195.80
Range: 1.125km Optimal 3.125km Falloff
Propulsion: Speed 996.71 m/s Align 4.50 s
[New Incurses, Gank]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Pseudoelectron Containment Field I
Adaptive Nano Plating II
1MN Afterburner II
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I
X5 Prototype Engine Enervator
Light Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Small Hybrid Burst Aerator I
Small Hybrid Collision Accelerator I
Hobgoblin II x1
Effective HP: 3,209 (Eve: 2,746)
Tank Ability: 3.22 DPS
Shield Resists - EM: 10.50%, Ex: 55.25%, Ki: 46.30%, Th: 28.40%
Armor Resists - EM: 64.85%, Ex: 36.73%, Ki: 54.31%, Th: 54.31%
Capacitor (Stable at 73.93%)
Volley Damage: 510.66
DPS: 229.31
Range: 1.293km Optimal 4.062km Falloff
Propulsion: Speed 1129 m/s Align 4.5 s
[New Incurses, Shields]
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Co-Processor II
1MN Afterburner II
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I
Medium Azeotropic Ward Salubrity I
Light Ion Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge S
Small Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Small Core Defense Field Extender I
Small Core Defense Field Extender I
Hobgoblin II x1
Effective HP: 5,961 (Eve: 5,075)
Tank Ability: 18.23 DPS
Shield Resists - EM: 38.75%, Ex: 56.25%, Ki: 47.50%, Th: 30.00%
Armor Resists - EM: 57.50%, Ex: 23.50%, Ki: 44.75%, Th: 44.75%
Capacitor (Stable at 80.89%)
Volley Damage: 425.91
DPS: 217.15
Range: .937km Optimal 2.5km Falloff
Propulsion: Speed 1129 m/s Align 4.5 s
FNG
Wow I am out of touch apparently. Is this part of the "no more Tiers" initiative? Cause for some reason I thought that was something that was still at the drawing-board phase...?
ReplyDeleteOnly problem with dual-rep Incursus is it lacks low slots for more resists -- dual-rep Myrm and Brutix rely on EANMs to keep incoming damage to a manageable level for the reps to work, this thing won't have that ... even a single/dual-rep Enyo at least has T2 resists to work with to prolong its life expectancy, in addition to whatever plates/resist mods you put on it.
Bet dual-rep Incursus goes pop to anything but another frig before the 2nd rep cycle finishes, assuming staggered reps.
Here all this time I thought active-tanking w/o cap boosters was dead because :neuts:, anyways. ;-)
Changes are already up on Sisi. Of course, they weren't when I started writing all this, but CCP is moving pretty fast on this one.
DeleteYou'd need to do roughly 1k DPS in 3 seconds to chew through the Incursus's armor buffer. That's not really feasible for most T1 Frigs, and allows the Incursus to operate under a flight of light drones with impunity. It also has another 1k ehp of Hull for anything that's slipping through.
You're probably right...assuming the other ship gets a perfect shot in. I'd still say it would do fine up close against Medium or Large weapons. The standard 2xTE 2xNeut Hurricane being an obvious exception.
Frigs have been doing fine with a Rep and a small buffer tank for quite some time...just not in large fights. Obviously my advice isn't directed at those where MWD/Disruptor/Overdrive fits become common in suicidal tackle roles. But, I don't advocate for suicide, even in internet spaceships.
You can put an EANM in place of the Mag Stab and still do good damage. I personally use two Auxilarry nano Pumps and and explosive rig and the tank is real nice. Yes DPS is lower but you can outlast almost anything of equivalent size long enough to make them go pop.
DeleteTry using null and watch how easy it is to do a close kite and make thrashers pop. the only real drawback is lack of web means a fast mover can run away from you if they are smart and realize in time.
If I calculate your dual rep setup, I get 144,6 uniform dps repped.
ReplyDeleteIf you really want to do injected dual rep, drop the magstab and dc2 for EANM2's. If the CPU doesn't fit, fit ions or change a EANM2 for an ANP2. It'll do 209.4 dps repped with a 1.45k armor buffer which in frig fights is sufficient for your reps to cycle.
This is before overheating, links, exile, implants etc.
Not sure why the small difference. Perhaps it's stacking related, as generally Ship Bonuses (Like the 10% bonus to Reps) don't have any stacking since you can only get it once. I can't exactly check your math, so I can't be certain.
DeleteAs to the changes in fitting, that works too. I get 214 with Dual Reps and Dual EANMIIs, by downgrading to Ions. While it's definitely more, I'm not sure how I feel about completely ignoring the large Hull buffer the Incursus now gets from a DCII. I'd also worry about the range of Ions in an armor tanked ship with no Web. Neutrons and Null get you 7.5km of Optimal+Falloff, Ions reduce that to 6.1km. This potentially lets an AB/Web/Scram Rifter with Barrage sit at range until you run out of Boosters. Granted, I look at a lot of Frigates as "How will this perform versus your average Rifter" because of how dominant the Rifter is in T1 Frigate PvP today. Maybe after the changes the playing field will change a bit.
You can downgrade the DC2 to some meta depending on isk and swap the mag stab for an EANM2 and keep the neutrons. You'll keep the hull buffer, but it's only interesting when you're taking more than 200 actual dps.
DeleteIMO, the Incursus will do best with something more like your gank fit but with different lows and rigs:
SAR2, DCmeta3, ANP2, small aux nano pump. The two remaining rig slots and low can go to a mag stab, TE, dmg rigs, expl-pump or falloff rigs depending on taste. The DC or the ANP2 might be upped if you go for a (meta)TE as the 4th low. This Incursus will outtank and outdps a similar fitted rifter.
Decent Incurses after the change will either use lasers (if using the rep bonus) in order to hit anyone beyond 5km, forego the rep bonus and use the 3rd mid for a web or only plan on pulsing the repper, since with no utility nos, that means no nos which means sustained repping will require a cap booster.
ReplyDeleteI disagree that the Neutron Incursus isn't "decent." At 5k DPS and tracking are better with Null than DLP with any ammo. With Scorch loaded, you get better results in excess of 6.5km, but there aren't an awful lot of ships an Incursus has any business fighting that are going to bring enough DPS to matter at that range. Any other T1 Frig that hopes to kill a Dual Rep fit would need to bring the fight to under 6km and have a Neut fit, which is a range that I think the Blaster fits will perform a lot better.
Delete